When it comes to bitcoin, legit concerns as well as misconceptions abound. Many financial advisors won't even consider client allocations to digital assets such as bitcoin. But given that the financial landscape has evolved, is it time for a rethink?
Watch the video above to catch up on the conversation between Ric Edelman, founder of the Digital Assets Council of Financial Professionals, and Brian Wallheimer, editor-in-chief of Financial Planning.
Transcription:
Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors. Please check the corresponding audio for the authoritative record.
Brian Wallheimer (00:10):
Welcome everyone. I'm Brian Wallheimer. I'm editor of Financial Planning. We appreciate you joining us for our leaders discussion today on crypto and investing. Today with us is Ric Edelman. He's founder of Edelman Financial Engines, the largest RI in the country, and now he's founder of the Digital Assets Council, financial Professionals, huge proponent of Bitcoin and crypto investing. Thank you for being here today, Ric.
Ric Edelman (00:34):
Great to be with you, Brian. Thanks.
Brian Wallheimer (00:37):
Yeah, so real quick, I'm wondering if you can kind of put it in perspective crypto with what's happening in the world today. Tariffs have taken over the stock market. We're seeing the s and p, the Dow, everything going down pretty significantly. Just initial thoughts there, so we at least address the elephant in the room.
Ric Edelman (01:02):
Yeah, it's hard to ignore what's going on in the world due to the president's policy on tariffs, and the only word that people keep reciting is uncertainty. And that is certainly true for the short term in the mid range. Nobody knows what's going to happen today, tomorrow, next week, next month, perhaps even six months or a year from now. But we do know ultimately this too shall pass because the world is not going to be able to tolerate or sustain declines of a major magnitude forever. So at some point, everything becomes a buying opportunity. So the real issue is the portfolio management decision that you have to make for yourself today and for your clients today. If you've been doing everything right, what's going on right now should be not a shock and B, not a cause for changing your strategy. If you believe in modern portfolio theory, if you own a diversified portfolio, if you have a long-term time horizon, if you believe in portfolio rebalancing and tax loss harvesting and dollar cost averaging, well, this is what the game is all about.
(02:04):
So you execute those strategies. This is a wonderful rebalancing opportunity. It's a wonderful buying opportunity, which unfortunately may get even better yet, it's a wonderful opportunity for tax loss harvesting. So just do your job. And that means as an advisor, your number one job is communication with your clients because they may not remember in their bullishness when they purchased a month or a year or a decade ago why they did it. They might need a reminder as to the investment strategy they agreed to, which you have recommended and endorsed, and now is the opportunity for you to show your true value, your true worth by getting in touch with their clients, reinforcing your philosophy and strategy, reminding them that this is the time to hang in there, not the time to pack.
Brian Wallheimer (02:50):
Sure, sure. I want to remind all of our attendees there is an opportunity to ask questions. There's a panel that I think you heard about in the opening video. Please go ahead and ask questions as you wish, and we'll get to as many as we can as we go. Thanks for that opening, Ric. You wrote a wealth think column for us that talked about Bitcoin investing today, and let's just say you were a little aggressive about it. This is where you need to be if you're a financial advisor, if you're an investor today that Bitcoin needs to be a part of this. Two quick parts of that. One, can you recap that a little bit? And two, you're very specific about Bitcoin as opposed to Ether and other coins. Tell me a little bit about what your thoughts are today on investing in crypto and why specifically Bitcoin.
Ric Edelman (03:42):
Well, first I'll say that I'm not a bitcoin maximalist. There are those who are, Michael Saylor is probably the best known proponent and makes a really strong case for why it should be Bitcoin and only Bitcoin in the world of crypto. I'm not a hundred percent in that camp, although I do lean towards that view. Bitcoin is the oldest. It is the original. It is the largest by far digital asset has about two thirds of the entire market cap of the entire crypto community. So it is the most commonly known. Even when people don't know anything about this subject, they've all heard of Bitcoin even if they don't know what it is. So it's the first best place to start. And for people who are brand new to this, it's where I would recommend you begin your investment journey. If you're going to jump down that rabbit hole to explore the world of crypto, it makes sense to begin with Bitcoin.
(04:34):
As you explore further and gain more knowledge, you can then begin to explore other digital assets. Ethereum becomes number two. It is the second largest digital asset between Bitcoin and Ethereum. They together own about 70% of the entire marketplace in crypto. In other words, look the Coke and Pepsi at crypto. So sure you can buy Mountain Dew and Dr. Pepper seven up, but frankly, if you got Coke and Pepsi, you kind of are done. If you want to delve deeper, if you want to broaden the allocation, sure, you can look into other coins like Solana and lco and Polygon and Aran and blah, blah, blah. But for most ordinary mere mortals, Bitcoin and Ethereum is fine for most folks. Having said that, why even them? What's the point to the question you raised Brian? And that is simply because of modern portfolio theory. Investing is all about, as we know, as Markowitz taught us, investing is as much about risk as it is return.
(05:33):
And the way that you manage risk, the way that you reduce the likelihood that your client will get wiped out from a calamity is to own a wide array of assets. And that's why we diversify. That's why we give our clients stocks, bonds, real estate, gold oil, natural resources, foreign assets, emerging markets. The more different kinds of asset classes you can give the client, the better off you are From an MPT perspective, all the numbers get better. We know this sharp ratio, standard deviation, max drawdown, Sortino ratio, the list goes on and on. All the MPT statistics get better the more diversified you are. Well, Bitcoin came along 15 years ago. It's a brand new asset class. In fact, it's the first new asset class in 170 years. The last time we had the invention of a new asset class was the discovery of oil in the 1850s.
(06:27):
So since it's a new asset class, if you believe in diversification, then you ought to be adding it to the portfolio. There's no reason not to. What has fascinated me, Brian, is how emotional the conversation has gotten. People have such strong opinions about Bitcoin, love it or hate it or disputed or skeptical, or what does that have to do with it? You have already in your diversified portfolio, you have assets you don't like, you have some assets you don't understand. Didn't he stop you from owning them? So why are you letting that happen with Bitcoin? So if you believe in MPT, you should simply acknowledge that this is a $2 trillion asset class right now. In fact, that's Bitcoin itself. If you look at the entire world of crypto, it's a $3 trillion asset. Now, put it on a global perspective. In the United States, the total value of all the assets is about a hundred trillion dollars. Bitcoin is 3 trillion, 3% of the total assets. Are you going to tell me that you're going to ignore an asset that has 3% of the market? Why would you do that? So when I say you should add Bitcoin to your portfolio, I'm saying it predominantly because Harry Markowitz tells us to do so
Brian Wallheimer (07:46):
Well. Okay, so you asked the question why not? And I think one of the big reasons for people for quite some time has been, well, what is Bitcoin? Is it an asset? Is it a security? What is the SEC going to do? Can you just catch us up? Catch us up? Where are we at today? And I know we have a fairly new president who is championing cryptocurrency and Bitcoin. Where are we today? And what about those concerns?
Ric Edelman (08:13):
Yeah, so first of all, I'll tell you that if you haven't invested in Bitcoin for the past 15 years, you are correct not to do so. A lot of people are fearful that it's too late to invest in Bitcoin, which is not true. I just wrote a white paper that you've referenced, Brian, on the six myths and misconceptions that are preventing people from buying Bitcoin today. And number one is it's too late, it's not too late. The fact that you didn't buy Bitcoin previously is because you're a prudent, smart, experienced financial advisor. If you looked at the incredible volatility of Bitcoin, the incredible uncertainty, will the government ban it? Might regulations prohibit? Is your compliance department going to allow it? You had a lot of legitimate reasons for not getting engaged. So I don't criticize people for not buying Bitcoin. I've been involved in it since 2012.
(09:07):
I created DAC FP in 2015, our crypto education company, the Digital Assets Council of Financial Professionals. But I don't blame you if you didn't get involved in 2015 or 2018 or 2022, but here we are today and today Bitcoin has been substantially. It's the same thing as buying Amazon stock. You weren't crazy not to buy it in 1999, but today it's incredibly common because it's Amazon and that's kind of where Bitcoin is on its journey today. So the whole fundamental issue is this Bitcoin, which is essentially blockchain technology. Bitcoin is the first product invented using this technology. This technology is simply software and it is better software than the software businesses currently use in their operations. And what is it? It's a ledger. That's all it is. And we use ledgers all the time in our businesses. We use them to track income and expenses, assets and liabilities.
(10:10):
We track inventories. Your checkbook at home is a ledger, right? You track deposits and withdrawals from your bank book. The problem with ledgers is that they're expensive to develop and manage. They are centralized, meaning only one person or one organization has access to that ledger. And because of those expenses, because of the sequestered nature of ledgers banks, they hire auditors to do the work that the accountants did, and then the government brings in bank examiners to verify the auditors. It's very complicated, very expensive, very cumbersome. Bitcoin uses blockchain technology, distributed ledger meaning instead of a ledger being on one company's database, that ledger is now diversified on tens of thousands of computers all around the world. The result is that it operates faster, it's cheaper, it's lower in risk. The cybersecurity is much enhanced. Bitcoin has never been hacked. Unlike every other computer system, it's far cheaper to use and it's more inclusionary because there's no intermediary.
(11:18):
There's no bank in between me and my customer. And as a result of this technology, it has become so exciting that almost every bank in the world is developing the technology. JP Morgan says that it's going to save banks $120 billion. It's going to result in t plus zero trading settlements. We already have Jamie Diamond's company settling $2 billion a day in cross border transactions using blockchain technology. Parmesano REO is using the technology to combat counterfeiting its cheese products. Brightling is doing the same thing, so is the Norwegian Salmon Association. So it's not just movement of money, it's also the movement of data and the ability to protect against fraud and abuse in astonishing new ways. So the technology is innovative, it's new and it's different. And if you're excited about technological innovation like ai, you have to be excited about technological technological innovations like blockchain as well. And Bitcoin is simply the biggest oldest ledger using this technology.
Brian Wallheimer (12:27):
Yeah,
Ric Edelman (12:28):
But what about, talk about them first. The SEC made it clear under Gary Gensler's tenure that Bitcoin is not a security. Now, this was good news and bad news. The good news is clarity. Everybody knows the drill, not a security, but that also meant bad news for advisors. You couldn't recommend it to clients for the same reason you don't recommend baseball cards and comic books. They're not securities either. That's why you don't recommend gold. That's not a security. Financial advisors are limited to recommending securities, stocks, bonds, ETFs, mutual funds. So until the gold ETF came about, you could never recommend gold to a client. And that has been the limitation with Bitcoin because the SEC said, it's not a security that meant Wall Street couldn't engage. The financial services industry had to stay out. But a year ago, last January of 24, the SEC allowed to the marketplace.
(13:29):
Bitcoin ETFs, just like it previously, allowed gold ETFs. The ETFs are securities. And now for the first time in Bitcoin's history, financial advisors are allowed to recommend not Bitcoin, but a Bitcoin etf, and they did to the tune of a hundred billion dollars of inflows, the fastest growing, most successful ETF launch in history because of the pent up demand in the marketplace. So there's now complete clarity. We have also had, as you noted earlier, regarding President Trump, a massive sea change in the election in November. Joe Biden was strongly opposed to Bitcoin. Elizabeth Warren strongly opposed to Bitcoin the most in the Democratic Party, strongly opposed, but we have had a massive change in the election. Donald Trump said this past summer that he wants the United States to be the crypto capital of the planet. He's already issued a number of executive orders, revoking all of the anti crypto stances of the Biden administration.
(14:31):
He fired or threatened to fire Gary Gensler. He ended up resigning the day Trump took office, and we now have in the administration an entirely pro crypto environment. The secretary of the Treasury of Labor of Commerce are all crypto supporters, the SEC chair, the CFTC chair, the FDIC chair, all strong crypto supporters, the same thing in Congress. We now have a majority in both parties who are favorable to crypto, so we no longer have the worry that the government might ban it or interfere with it or try to diminish it. Instead, the government recognizes that this technology is exactly that technology and it represents high paying green jobs that can boost the US economy. What's not to love? It's one of the few areas where we now have bipartisan support. So you're going to see over the next 12 to 18 months a slew of new regulation and legislation that will provide the clarity everybody needs. But in the meantime, you have the clarity that you need. Our most important point, the availability of the ETFs. We now have Bitcoin ETFs, we have Atherium ETFs, we have two X ETFs, we have buffer ETFs, we have income producing ETFs. We have all the portfolio tools you need to finally, for the first time ever be able to allocate crypto to your clients.
Brian Wallheimer (15:54):
One of the two first questions that came in from the audience were specifically about how to own crypto, and one of 'em was thoughts on self custody versus centralized honeypots. One of 'em was thoughts on storing the actual assets in a digital wallet versus platform versus ET tf. And I know you and I talked earlier about that. That was one of the concerns that a lot of people I think had right, was it is complicated. I have to have this wallet. I have to hot storage, cold storage rule, all these things. Where are you? How should people own crypto?
Ric Edelman (16:26):
Yeah. One of the big hassles of Bitcoin has been that it hasn't been easy to own because it's a decentralized asset on the blockchain, available internet only. You had to open, you had to get an online digital wallet. You had to open an account such as like Coinbase or Kraken or Gemini where you had to go to a defi wallet like Meta Mask or Unis Swap. I'm throwing out jargon to you, aren't I? This is intimidating, this is new, this is scary, it's cumbersome, it's complicated, and then you got to link all the stuff to your bank account. Even more scary, even more intimidating. What a hassle. Especially since most people are going to allocate low single digits, 1, 2, 3, 4%. Is it worth all that hassle just for a lousy 2% allocation? This is why it was just as easy to say the heck with it.
(17:13):
But now we have the ETFs, the most popular investment vehicle on the planet. You use ETFs all the time in your practice. Your clients are very familiar with them, they understand 'em very well. They're incredibly easy to use a very low cost. These Bitcoin ETFs are 20 or 25 basis points. They're incredibly inexpensive, and you can add them to your brokerage account alongside all of your other ETFs where you could do your rebalancing and dollar cost averaging and harvesting. Simple, clean, easy. You don't need a digital wallet, you don't need private keys or public keys. You can ignore all that nonsense the same way you do with owning gold. Would you tell a client to buy gold? Go to a coin dealer and buy gold bars or wafers or coins and figure out where to store them and how to protect 'em, and who would go through all that hassle?
(17:57):
You just buy a gold et f, you get the same thing without any must, with NA fuss. Same thing with Bitcoin ETFs. So for most mere mortals, the ETFs are the way to go. It's the cheapest, easiest, most convenient way to have access to Bitcoin. Now, one downside to the ETFs, they are securities, which means they only trade during market hours. Bitcoin we know trades 24 7. Look at this past weekend as a perfect example with all the turmoil on the markets. Last Thursday and Friday, if you wanted to trade stocks on Saturday, you couldn't do it. You had to wait for the market to open this morning. Same thing with Bitcoin. If you own the ETF, you got to wait for the market to open. But if you own Bitcoin directly at Coinbase trades 24 7, so if you're the kind of person who likes to trade, then you might prefer a wallet at Coinbase.
(18:46):
But if you're an advisor who counsels your client to be a long-term investor making a decision that you're going to own for a decade, why do you need to trade 24 7? I think you can wait till Monday. So for most investors, most advisors, the ETFs are perfectly fine, simplest, easiest, cheapest, and I argue safest way for you to own it as well. And why do I say safest, Brian? Because that ETF is sponsored by BlackRock or Fidelity or Franklin Templeton, do you really think BlackRock is going to expose you to criminal fraud or abuse? Do you think if something like abuse did occur, BlackRock wouldn't stand behind it? Reputationally, I think you eliminated a lot of the risks of fraud and abuse by working with the ETFs, which are regulated by the SEC and FINRA to give you additional securities protection as well as of course your state regulators
Brian Wallheimer (19:40):
Or we've got a number of other questions. I'm going to bring in a hot one here for you and let you have some fun here. Ric, please explain how owning Amazon or any equity is anything at all like owning a ledger system with a made up currency that only works on that ledger system.
Ric Edelman (19:56):
Well, it's not made up. First of all, it is very simply recognizing that just as Amazon is made up, I mean, how does Amazon be any different from Barnes and Noble? So what really matters is the book, right? You're buying the book at the platform, and that's the same thing here. Do you want to use this as a store of value or do you want to use this as a transmittal? Those are the two functions that blockchain serve. Now, what is happening right now is that there are hundreds of billions of dollars being moved around the world on blockchain technology. In other words, if you want to wire money to mama who lives in South America, you've got to go to your bank. Mama's got to have a bank account, and then you've got to pay the wire transfer fee, or you got to go to Western Union and pay their fees.
(20:49):
It can take three to five days to wire money internationally, and the average cost is 6%. But if you do it with Bitcoin, neither of you, not you not mama, neither of you need a bank account. You simply need a cell phone, not even a smartphone, just an ordinary cell phone, and you can send the money to mama in less than 10 minutes virtually for free. This is why we're seeing hundreds of billions of dollars being transferred around the world through cross-border transmittals using blockchain technology. This is why the banks are so excited about this technology because they can move the money faster, and we know the faster it moves, the safer it becomes and the lower the cost is. So this is why there's so much excitement about it. Now that doesn't make any sense to you. Then you might as well drive down the road to a Barnes and Noble to buy a book instead of going to Amazon to buy a book online where they'll deliver it in a couple of hours.
(21:43):
This is the same thing. It's simply technology that is making the movement of money faster, cheaper, safer, easier. Now, that's the transmittal argument. There's also a store of value argument, and this is where Michael Saylor comes into tune. I recommend you go to YouTube down, just Google, Michael Saylor, watch some of his videos. He's very articulate in his explanation. Bottom line is this, we know that a lot of us are holding cash. We routinely advise our clients to hold cash, right? Cash reserves, where do we store it in the bank, cd, money market account, T-bills, et cetera. We also know due to inflation that those accounts fall in value over time because they don't earn as much as the inflation rate on an after-tax basis. So why? If you're holding assets as a store of value, why would you hold them in a value that declines?
(22:32):
Why not put them into an asset where the value is either stable or rising? And the argument is that Bitcoin over its 15 year history, despite its incredible volatility in short periods, has grown in value dramatically. Well beating not just the price of inflation, but the value growth of any other asset class. This is the store of value argument. Now, it's easy for you to argue about it. It's easy for you to dispute it. I won't try to debate the point with you. I'll simply say this, half a billion people in the world believe in this argument. You don't have to believe it. All you've got to acknowledge is that other people believe it. In other words, it's supply and demand. If there is a big demand for something and the supply is limited, in the case of Bitcoin, the supply is actually fixed. There can't be a printing of more bitcoins the way the government can print dollars.
(23:29):
If the supply is fixed and the demand is rising, then the price has to rise. That's the fundamental investment thesis, and you only have to make one decision. Are you willing to allocate one or 2% of client assets to that thesis? If you are not willing to, I believe you're actually making a more extreme bet than if you do allocate 1%. If you allocate zero to Bitcoin, you are saying this has no validity. It will never have validity. The price will never go up and will actually even fall. That is a very extreme point of view. A far less extreme point of view is to simply say, I don't get it, but a whole lot of other people do. I'm just going to ride their coattails with a 1% or 2% allocation. I'll rebalance it like I do the rest of the portfolio and I'll call it a day. You don't have to believe in emerging markets. You don't have to believe in oil. You don't have to believe in gold. You don't have to believe in natural resources. You don't have to believe in large cap, small cap, mid cap in order to allocate to them. Bitcoin is the same thing.
Brian Wallheimer (24:37):
We talked a little bit, I want to ask real quick before I get to it, but what percentage now, because a few years ago you came and spoke at one of our conferences, and I believe you were talking 1% there in your column. Did you say 5%
Ric Edelman (24:51):
Up to? Is that right? So you're right. Why did I say one before? It was because Bitcoin was brand new and I knew that people were reticent hesitant to do it with a 1% allocation. So what if it blows up? Your client ends up with 99% left, it wouldn't harm anybody. It wouldn't destroy your financial security if you invested 1% and it went badly. It was an effort to say to you, put a toe on the water. Now though, as we fast forward, I wrote that book five years ago. As we fast forward to today with the world, so different Bitcoin's market cap at 3 trillion, every government around the world racing to adopt the technology, every bank around the world doing this Wall Street falling over itself to offer crypto products, it has been largely de-risked. The question, will it go to zero is really gone and therefore it makes more sense. If you're going to allocate instead of doing one, do two or three up to five, that's still quite different from the 60% you're putting into stocks. So do small single digits and I think you'll be just fine.
Brian Wallheimer (25:58):
Let's talk about meme coins for a second. There's a question about meme coins. If we were concerned if people had concerns about the SEC and all these things before and the confusion and hot storage code, there's all these things kind of making it difficult to wrap your mind on it. Now, we throw in things like meme coins. What are they and what should people be thinking about them? Are they a part of this investment strategy or are they not a part of it? Where are you on this?
Ric Edelman (26:25):
There's probably one asset class that you have never recommended to your client. Penny stocks, pig sheets, meme coins are the penny stocks of crypto. Most of them, just like most penny stocks, most meme coins are a scam or a marketing campaign or a fly-by-night organization. You should stay away from meme coins. You should strongly encourage your clients to stay away from meme coins. Investing in coins compared to Bitcoin is literally a comparison of penny stocks to the s and p 500.
Brian Wallheimer (27:09):
Okay, here's a good question about quantum computing. There's concerns that quantum computing will be able to break the Bitcoin code rendering, rendering it worthless. What are your thoughts there, Ric?
Ric Edelman (27:22):
Yeah, it's really interesting how hard people will go to come up with excuses to hate Bitcoin. And this one is kind of the funniest. I get it. We know that Bitcoin is a digital asset and if the digital internet security is threatened, therefore the asset can be threatened and we're all paying attention to quantum computing. But think about it, quantum computing is not a threat to Bitcoin. And let me tell you why. If I can create code using quantum computing to crack the cryptography of Bitcoin, then can't I create quantum computing code to defend against that? In fact, the National Institute of Technology Standards has already done that. They've already created code to combat quantum computing from breaking cryptographic security. In other words, if you show up with a 10 foot ladder, all I got to do is build a 12 foot wall. So in other words, if quantum computing can be used to hack Bitcoin, then quantum computing can be used to protect Bitcoin.
(28:33):
It's a zero sum game. Not going to it's mutually exclusive, but I'll take it a step further. The research that's been done on the Bitcoin blockchain has determined that it would take about $6 billion to build the computing power to hack it. If somebody had the $6 billion, why would they need to hack Bitcoin? Why would they bother hacking Bitcoin? In fact, if you had the ability to crack any cryptography, why would you attack Bitcoin with it? If you were North Korea, Iran, Russia, China, any rogue nation, if you were some hacker in a basement of a parent's house as a teenager coming up with code to crack, why would you go after the Bitcoin blockchain? If you stole all the Bitcoin, you'd be making all of it worthless because who would you be able to sell it to? It's like the guy who steals the Mona Lisa, who are you going to sell it to?
(29:28):
Everybody knows it's the Mona Lisa. You can't sell it to anybody. Wouldn't it be smarter to go after JP Morgan's bank deposits or chase Manhattan or Wells Fargo because cash is cash? Much rather steal a cash out of a bank because the cash will still hold value. Wouldn't it make sense to go after them and they hold far more value than Bitcoin does? I'll take it a step further. Why stop there? Why wouldn't you instead hack the air traffic control system or our electrical grid or our nuclear codes for our missiles in the defense department? In other words, if you have a quantum computer that can do this incredible thing to Bitcoin, why on earth would you care about Bitcoin? You're going to have, my point is this, if you are right and quantum computing breaks cryptography, we're going to have a lot more worries on our hands than your account at Bitcoin.
Brian Wallheimer (30:22):
We're about out of time. I want to squeeze one more in because I like the question and I think it's a good one for us to end on. Ric, why is Bitcoin volatility so tied to the general market and will its value ever be independent?
Ric Edelman (30:35):
Its value has for most of its history, been entirely independent. It's only been in the recent couple of years that its price movements have been in sync with Wall Street, and that's because of the new institutional engagement. And this is a good thing for Bitcoin. Bitcoin is now moving in sync with the market because the institutional players are involved. Endowment funds, pension funds, insurance companies, major Wall Street firms, hedge funds, family offices are all engaging in this sovereign wealth funds, you name it. And when they allocate to Bitcoin, they're doing it on a diversified basis within their portfolio. So when they sell due to nonsense like we're experiencing now in the market, they sell everything, they rebalance everything. That's a good sign that this is becoming Main Street. This is becoming an institutionally adopted asset. And think about the trillions of dollars that are flowing into Bitcoin because of institutional engagement. This is a big reason why many people believe a supply demand equation is going to skyrocket as demand is going to take off because of the institutional involvement. That means you're going to see it. Its non-correlation will decline as it becomes more and more correlated. But so what you're going to see price increases unlike anything we've seen in years past, which is why many are predicting that Bitcoin's price by the end of the decade will be between 500,000 and a million dollars, which would be 10 to 15 x over where we are now.
Brian Wallheimer (32:06):
Alright, well there's a lot of info there. I appreciate your time and all of the thoughtful answers there. I apologize to our audience. We had a number of other questions in there, we just don't have time to get to today. But Ric, we may just have to have you back.
Ric Edelman (32:19):
Happy to do it, Brian. Anytime.
Brian Wallheimer (32:22):
Absolutely. Well again, Brian Heimer for financial planning. And Ric, thank you so much again for your time and audience for the thoughtful questions. We'll see you soon.
